The Hi there, I'm Loïc, the host of this podcast. Les frappés is a French word that refers to people doing wild things in sports, business and life. In this episode, I'm interviewing longtime friends Petra and Thomas, parents of Leo and Raph, twins who were born at just 26 weeks and were soon after diagnosed with cerebral policy, a group of movement disorders caused by damage to the developing brain. Parenting can be tough at times. Petra and Thomas had to learn to become parents while being under heavy stress on a daily basis because their children had to be put on oxygen to stay alive. Because all of a sudden they were on a non-stop mission to answer Raph and Leo's special needs. Because their relationship suffered from the many many sleepless nights that they regularly had to spend in emergency rooms. This is the story of Petra and Thomas, ordinary people who became extraordinary parents. To me, and I'm sure for many others who will discover them in this episode, they are unsung heroes, leaving examples of what resilience and love can accomplish. So sit back, relax, and enjoy the conversation, but be ready to be as much inspired as you'll be moved. welcome on the podcast uh i guess first things first um i'm absolutely sorry for all our english-speaking audience uh for my rusty english it's been quite a long time but i'm gonna enjoy the exercise it's gonna be good practice for me so thanks for the opportunity uh thomas and betra thank you for having us thank you for having us pleasure so a little bit of context before we start so thomas so we of course know each others um thomas we pretty much i guess we've been friends for like what a quarter of a century now no no it's 30 years buddy no yeah yeah 30 years wow that's quite a long time and um petra well we met, when was that actually? 2014, right? The wedding. Or just before. So quite a long time as well. So actually, I am super happy to have you on the podcast, of course, because we're friends, because it's in English, and because I've had that in mind for quite some time now to ask you some questions. Les Frappés is on resilience and resilience. Do you even say that in English? Yeah, you do. And well, peak performance in sports, which is not really what we're going to talk about, but resilience in general. And I mean, the life you guys have for me is probably the most inspiring you know, jaw-dropping example of resilience I have in my circle of friends and family it's so many lessons I'm sure that people will take away from that conversation but that's already too much talking for me I guess as a kickoff how would you introduce yourself oh wow you put us on the spot here I don't know we met in England we we're very active we're very passionate about everything we do and we
Loïc recently moved to France, recently two years back
The yeah, we recently moved to France after 12 years in UK for me and 18 for Petra wow, that's a lot of time without the sun, right? yeah, that's pretty much the main reason we came back that and the kids obviously so we decided to have kids and we were very excited to have twins right? yeah sure and yeah that's when all of the story started really now we
Loïc it went down the hill I would say not when it started, it started really well and then kids were born and it just knock you
The yeah yeah then it became hectic but um before before we uh we go into more details um on on um the kids and and how your life uh your life changed actually i know a lot of answers to the question i'm gonna ask but this one i don't know or at least i don't remember exactly how did you guys meet in the first place oh it's it's not so I remember it was at work but was there something special like is there a special story there it's not really special it's just for me my job was my passion and I wanted to work in London I wanted to work in the best club in the world which I managed to do and when I got there which was difficult which was which was very difficult to get in to be fair after six months of going there every month and trying to sneak in and talk to a manager and just pretend i had an appointment interview whatever i got there and as destiny had it they asked me for which days off i wanted and i asked for the same days off as my flatmate and turns out it was the same days off as petra and if he was just two days away or two days before we would never meet so I met her on my first night shift ever and for me for me that was like yeah love struck that was it wow do you remember like the room? yes yes I remember the place tell us more I was sitting in a canteen I remember everything so tell us more I mean what can you say I was sitting on her spot actually and she walked into the room, she turned around and she smiled and said something and I don't know what she said. I just saw the smile and it was the perfect dream future wife. If you ever think what you want in life, that was it.
Loïc Have you seen those cartoons when you've got like, when they opened the mouth and the tangles out and the eyes pop out? That was him.
The So you actually noticed him, right?
Loïc On that first night?
The When he was looking at you?
Loïc I've seen, I saw he was looking weird. It's a bit weird how he's looking. And then I was talking with my colleague. And I'm saying, listen, this new guy, he's really intense, isn't he? He's quite weird. And she says, no, he's looking like that at everyone. So, okay.
The Well, well.
Loïc That was another pretty colleague, though. This is Barbara.
The Yeah, I mean, to be fair, the casino, you are the best dealer or croupier in the world. And at the time, it was very... They selected who they hired. If you were a man, you are to be very, very good. But if you were a woman, you are to be very, very pretty. And you are pretty girls from all over the world. There was 230 of us. There were 65 different nationalities there. And so there was plenty of Eastern European women. And yeah, I mean, they were all stunning to me. So how is it to work? Because I actually know a bit from your professional stories, working in, I mean, not just a casino, like one of the casinos, right? If I remember well. So maybe in the first place, what attracted you to that sort of career? And let's start with Petra. And what was it to work in such, I guess, an intense, super high standards environment?
Loïc Well, it wasn't really a difficult choice for me. I'm coming from a nursing background. so when i came to england i was working as a care assistant with the um immobile old people and it was really difficult work and basically one colleague of mine i was very unhappy when i was working and one colleague of mine polish woman her partner was working in a casino and she says but why why are you working here you know you're pretty you young you've got good english go and try to do casino but my idea of the casino at the time was what you see in the movie you know like oh i will will i be required to sleep with someone um so i went for interview which went very well and then yeah i was hired straight away i went i went for a training school and um yeah i was in one casino for two years and then i went that was just like normal average casino and then I went for interview to this one and again they hired me straight away and that's it. It was amazing, you know, like I always remember my background where I'm coming from, like the working in the hospital was difficult and working with old people was difficult and casino you you dress in a nightgown, you have to look pretty, they give you food for free, you've got tips, you know you you're working with the posh people there is a lot of wealthy people the casino look like you know you've got the one room which was just like a gold room and then napoleon room napoleon room and and basically it's a no-brainer when when we say napoleon it was the actual
The belongings of napoleon was furnishing the room yeah i remember that so it was it was amazing and
Loïc And back in the days, you used to have celebrities, not just English celebrities, but American celebrities coming to the casino. And it was exciting. And casino is exciting. It was entertaining to be dealing a roulette. You really enjoyed it. It's a rush, adrenaline rush.
The Yeah. yeah yeah yeah and you uh thomas because your story is a bit uh special as well because i remember when uh in france we have this exam baccalaureate um and we so we we we were in the same uh year at school and i remember uh the exam english when you told me what you understood from the text we had to read and what the text was actually about i was like what the fuck how could you know read that i mean it was about i don't know like um you know or to went to harvest a forest and you understood that it was about uh i don't know space exploration or something like that you know like wow and yet not that long afterwards you decided to um well to uh start a new life and that was in the UK not really I'm not exaggerating you were not speaking English at all my level was so bad that in University of Science where the English is very minimal I had 5% so I couldn't say anything it wasn't starting a new life it was just starting my life like I just decided in France, there's nothing exciting for me. I just wanted to travel. I just wanted to explore the world and find out what life is about. So I found a training school. It was a French training school which was doing training for becoming a groupier in England. And they were guaranteeing 100% that you get a job in a casino in the UK.
Loïc It's not difficult now.
The No, it's not difficult.
Loïc We didn't know that.
The But when you considered, and I couldn't speak English, and I had to find a place to live, open a bank account, all these things, it's trivial. But when you don't speak the language, it's tough. So the training school helped me. And they taught me the basic English for three months. The plan was to work a bit in the UK and then go on a cruise ship. so for three months I barely understood English and then I went to Scotland and that was
Loïc you forgot all what you learned
The it's another language man Scotland it's so tough so yeah I scrubbed the bottom of you know the worst casino in the UK for a couple of years before getting to London and I realized London is the best and I also found out casino was my passion so I just made a choice either go on a cruise ship at actually an interview set up I remember that at the interview set up and I got a phone call saying I can go to London where it's the best casino in the world and I made the decision I don't regret it and here I went so yeah the casino was challenging sometimes like the pressure is it's not like you don't scan an item in a shopping, you know, like you're a cashier and you forgot to scan an item. Like what's going to happen to you? Nothing. There, if you make a mistake, it could cost you literally millions. Like you turn one card over when you shouldn't, the customer sees it or you draw one card too much and he's like, I want the refund for the whole shoe and it costs you like four millions. So in that type of environment, you have to be spot on for the whole time. I don't think I ever did a mistake in nine years in the club. It was like constantly, constantly, you have to be on top of your game. And it was so great. It was amazing. So that's what I would like for you two to describe because I can't really say I've been to real casinos probably twice in my life or birthday of France or something like that, but never really played. And I don't know if we have that strong of a casino culture in France. Not really. Well, actually, I don't really know where this episode is going to be listened to the most since it's in English. but what's so special about casinos of that standing? Because so far you did not mention the name. I don't know. Do you guys want to say the name of the place where you worked or no? You would rather not. Why? Well, we can say where it was. It was in Mayfair, London. Yeah. Which is like... Mayfair is just the...
Loïc The rich part of London where rich people...
The So that's where you find the best casinos in Europe and the world. Yeah. Okay.
Loïc It's definitely not Las Vegas.
The No, I mean, Las Vegas is for people like you and I, where we go for a stag do for a holiday, and we spend a few hundred quid, a few hundred dollars. We have fun. There's a lot, a lot of people. Yeah, it's a mass casino, right? Yeah, it's a mass.
Loïc It's about the quantity.
The Our casino was like, if we had three high rollers, one high roller was on the top floor one on the middle floor one on the main floor and you close the gate you close the casino and no one else comes in
Loïc you could have easily just one customer in the whole casino and you're busy
The ah yeah
Loïc yeah
The holy cow because he's going to come and play like 10 millions so yeah yeah so that's to understand the scale of it so you said about like more than 200 employees which is huge for I mean a single building
Loïc yeah you had like 35 but that's okay that's not because no because we go restaurant stuff you know it's it's not it's for casino it's very small you can have you have casino which is only gaming stuff 200 300 oh yeah we had about 70 80 yeah we were 80 on the gaming floor so that's very small
The community so and a regular night like how much would be i don't know what's the word played by customers? Clients? Turnover. You could say turnover. I mean, we had a guy, he came for a week and he turned over 20 billion in a week. How much? 20 billion.
Loïc Billion? Then you can have weeks when there is, you can have a month when no one walks in. It's not, it's not normal casting.
The He played 20 billion in a week so let's say you go to a casino and you get a thousand euro you put a hundred euro down all night hundred euro hundred euro you go out with two thousand euros you played a thousand but you rolled it over maybe 50 times so you go yeah okay i see what you mean okay yeah because he's playing over a week so he came in with 10 million for a week he came out with 20 million plus he got bonuses because he did turnover. And that's how casino work in May. If you do a turnover, they give you a bonus because the more turnover, the more risk to lose it all. I see. Yeah. So what's the actual turnover of the casino overall? More or less like a broad range? As a business? Yeah, in a single year? Well, hundreds of billions. Holy shit. Okay, so when I was talking about high standards, I guess that was not an exhilaration. No, no, no. I mean, every day we do the count and we count how much money there is in the box. There isn't actual money because they do a bank transfer and then we give them chips in plastic, right? Yeah. Or they've got a check or something. A normal night, there will be, I don't know, two or three million in a table. so if you know two or three million doesn't mean the casino is winning two or three million but that's how much money is coming in and yeah yeah no it was it was it was so exciting like when when someone comes and you know they did the bank transfer for 10 million and they come to your table and they're like i like you you're staying here and you stay there for three hours and for three hours you're in charge of the table it the thrill i've got goosebumps it was it was fantastic my first game ever I remember for the rest of my life my first ever spin of the ball was the biggest spin of my life the guy on roulette laid out 357 thousand euros like a mortgage in one spin in one spin and I hit the biggest number it was 784,000 I paid my first spin wow and I double spin so I paid it again yeah no that was good What's the craziest encounter or story from a client you can remember, Petra?
Loïc Okay, the most exciting... We're not going to be saying the names.
The It was the son of a French politician.
Loïc The son of a French politician. Crazy, crazy, crazy guy. And he came and he was spending a crazy amount of money. and he was tipping even more. That was our bigger tipper, the biggest tipper ever.
The Every time he would hit a number, the minimum he would tip would be 5,000 euros. He would tip up to 50,000 euros in one go and he was there for a week.
Loïc And he was sneaking in. Usually you have to pass the chips to the dealer and the dealer has to record it, give it to the instructor and then you put it down. And he basically skipped the whole process and he just took it out the plancher of the table of the roulette table and he just sneaked the chips in and you didn't know
The how much. So until the next day when you open the box and you count the chips you didn't know how much chips was there. Wow.
Loïc But otherwise it was really good. You know I had Bono walking to the table introducing he shake my hand and say hello I'm Bono I know. you had the yeah different celebrities you had supermodels you had the footballers
The oh my god sometimes you didn't recognize people my god so i got promoted uh for for pit boss which is like small small manager and one of my first week or months or something a couple walks in and I'm going there all friendly nice what can I do for you I'll show you around and we're having chit chat and I go about my business you know and then the dealer goes to me oh my god oh my god oh how was she how was she what do you mean she's you're spine like what's up well that was Heidi Klum like supermodel Heidi Klum like what I didn't know I had to google and I was like, oh my God, how can you be so ignorant, Thomas? For me, the craziest story was that blackjack game where the guy came and he put £5,000 in cash on my table. He played one hand, he lost it, he put £10,000 in cash, he lost it, he put £25,000 in cash, he lost it. At that point, I'm calling the manager over like, please come and get that money off my table because I can't put it in the box. But that's not forbidden to do that, to double your... No?
Loïc No.
The No.
Loïc You can go to the max of the table.
The You can go to the max of the table. And then when you reach the max, well, that's why you got maximum on the table, to avoid people robbing the casino because they got so much money, they can double, double, double. And then he asked his bodyguard, because, yeah, he had the bodyguard, for a little, like, handbag. And there was 50 grand in the handbag. So he put down my table. He lost it. And then he said, oh, give me the backpack. And there was a hundred grand in the backpack. Wow. And he plays and he lost it. So now my table is covered in cash. And I'm like, please come and take that cash away.
Loïc It's basically stacks.
The Stacks of money. So I don't know. I must have like 200K on my table. And then he says to the bodyguard, go to the car. And he came to the table, I swear, with the body bag. And it was 250 grand in cash. and he dumped it on the table and I'm like what's happening here? like it was my first year in the club what's going on? yeah so that was, he lost it all he lost it all and left, he was almost 500k in cash and thank you, bye
Loïc chill as a cucumber
The yeah, not upset, nothing wrong, just left that was fantastic wow, does that make you lose like I don't know how to phrase it properly but yes it does yeah you blasé about money after this
Loïc yes yeah right yeah like uh group year seems to have a higher expectations of the like you go for holidays because you're surrounded by money so you kind of you know you've got the bigger spending as
The well yeah you go higher standard you've got higher standard bigger spending than any other type of because you're surrounded with it yeah and you expect that that's one thing i miss from mayfair in london it's the customer service there's nothing like customer service in mayfair i've heard dubai is the same it's amazing but now i was thinking maybe now we move to can there will be a good customer service but it's awful yeah it's really really bad so can you can you tell us a story of something you did like the extra mile for one of those customers that really can illustrate that level of, you know, that standard. It's every day, every customer. So what is it? It's the way you greet them. It's the way you talk to them. Yeah, everything. You never say no. You never say no. And whatever they want, you make sure you give them. As long as you're not breaking the law and, you know, uncomfortable with what they ask you, if they tell you, can you please stay on the table for eight hours? you stay on the table for eight hours okay you're gonna go for a break you're gonna go for the loo but they close the table and when you come back you start the game again okay i've got the example
Loïc you know um i think what reflects really customer service is uh there is another side of the casino as well when when people enter the casino they've got their casino face right so you can be nice and lovely on the outside you you walk in and you um not nice yeah not to not to swear um and and this is it you know they're going to be you you are there in a lot of uncomfortable situations where people are swearing at you in your face in body close body language or you know they can be violent and you just they're standing with the plastered and and you just you just perfect customer service you know you smile you you know in in those situations the best reply is not to reply you just smile sometimes you're just being like polite you avoid you avoid the you know you're not eye contact yeah but um but but still you you did you do it does require practice when when when you uncomfortable and you're in a bad position and you're still polite and you're still on top of your game that's so difficult yeah it was it was you know you can have you can have a for me for me it was uh swearing in when the russian games and they swear like you can swear at me in english i really don't get offended you start to swear at me in russia and it just hits differently like they like french like they can swear you know like like english is so boring you could just like five swear words and you can really you can make a little combinations there but when you start describing in russia it's just so you you also understand and speak russian
The well it's slav language you know she did study and at one point she's very humble but she does understand and she used to speak if she wanted
Loïc you understand like 30% you know I'm Slovak so I understand Czech fluently Polish very very well and then you've got the Croatian and you know all the other Slav languages
The wow well I know now I know a little bit more about casino world at least of that standard so super interesting so if we come back to you two guys when so after that first like weird look that that you had Thomas when you saw Petra for the first time when did the story actually start between you two when when did you become a couple two months two months after two months after I did I did swore to myself that this club was probably where I'm gonna make a career so I need to be very careful what I'm gonna do I cannot jump into anything and if I find anyone which I want to go further I need to wait so I did wait and two months later I was supposed to help her with a French because she had exams it was a Christmas party yes but it was like a good excuse right no
Loïc first time we proper started to talk was a Christmas party when I told him I will never ever ever start with anyone i never had anyone younger his ages younger than me so yeah forget it like i i i you know i made sure i put him down that i'm very clear oh she did put me down all right
The destroyed me guys like if you go after eastern europe be prepared they're gonna destroy you
Loïc so yeah so we started uh i just didn't want you to have a false hope thank you
The so yeah Christmas party I don't know what to say in English like when you declare your flame but it's not your flame you're just trying to chatter up or ask her out for the first time and that was a big no but then I played you know I'm new here I don't know anyone it would be nice if I can help you in French because you know
Loïc I was studying French at the time I was at the university
The I mean that was crazy Loic that could be part of you know she she she used to work three days in the casino free night shift take the train euro star to go to paris to work to do four days of uni every week for how long
Loïc nine months yeah one year yeah really i didn't know that yeah so i i studied um so casino was really as i told you you can have very busy period and you can have very quiet when i started it was it was you had triple breaks so you were half an hour on the table and then you went on double or triple break which is one break is 30 minutes so you can spend 30 minutes on the table and you've got hour and a half break so i said listen i'm going to study there were there were girls and they were studying at the university and i always wanted to study so i said i'm going to find as well so i decided for um international business with french language and it was four years and the the third year three was uh in paris was compulsory so oh i found the way basically i saved all my holiday i was i went part-time i did uh i'd take so i was working only four days and then on on day three i took holiday for the whole whole year so I managed so Monday to Friday I was at the university in Paris and then Friday night I sat on Eurostar I went directly to work I worked three night shifts and then again Monday
The wow
Loïc yeah it was hectic
The wow but at least that gave Thomas a good excuse to see you regularly
Loïc I think it was the last time he spoke French with me since then no I think 2014 was the last time
The so what made you change your mind then Petra about the never never gonna date a younger guy perseverance that's true but what did you see actually I mean it's funny but what did you see in Thomas that made you like reconsider this
Loïc there was a colleague of mine who really contributed at the time actually when thomas arrived uh to casino i was i was just i just i just split up i just split up with someone i was in a relationship for five and a half years and for me i thought it's going to be the person for me right um so i was very heartbroken so i was not looking into relationship at all you know um but this guy was really really routed for him and then um nothing we just um So after the Christmas party, I actually texted him because he didn't. So I told him nothing will ever happen. But then Thomas is saying, oh, but I'm new in London. I have no one to know. Would you go out just as a friend? And I'm saying, yeah, sure. Because I had to look at you. I took it. It was, you know, sincere because I was struggling with that as well. London is massive, massive town, but you don't, you don't, you don't have a opportunity to meet people. You know, if you, if you're doing night shifts, if you're in a casino, it's, it's, it's more tricky to, to keep social life. So, so we exchanged numbers and then, and then three days later and he doesn't, he doesn't text me. And I say, well, what is this guy? So first he's there and he was propagated when i told him no and then he doesn't even reply right like he doesn't
The the three days rule the three days rule that that's the thing it is a thing if you don't reply if you don't call for three days and she's the one calling you that's it
Loïc there was there was a strategy there right very very successful and then and then really i really needed help for for french homework you know when i was writing um for for university i had some project uh so i asked him to to to study with me and that was it we never studied but then at least not french still i didn't i didn't for six months seven months seven months it was still july she was like you know after the uni is
The over you're done bye-bye it's you know like yeah it's not going anywhere this it's only fun funny
Loïc business you know yeah i don't have time for you you know you know you're too young and then yeah
The after seven months i said i don't know i give up perseverance like perseverance yeah so if we do a A bit of fast forward. When was it that you guys decided to actually get married and have kids? Because what I remember, but tell me if I'm wrong, is it was pretty clear for you that there would be a wedding, then there would be kids, right? That was sort of a plan from the start. We always have plans. We've got a long-term plan, a short-term plan. we've got uh we we we moved in together and we said right so we're gonna move in together and if it's good then we're gonna buy a house together can i yeah this was what what actually how he got
Loïc me right so i just reminded me of that uh so i was saving for buying property for a few years but my ex he never got into i was i was since i was working in a casino i had better income i was saving more and he never got around to to save money right now we've been together for about two months maybe and i'm saying i want to buy property and he said wait i'm not going to wait i've been waiting for past five years i've got enough of waiting i'm buying property and he said no wait for me because if you're buying property i don't want to be just there as a move in with you i want i won't have be mine so he sat down and he wrote he wrote and do you remember he wrote a list and basically every month so so let's say it was february when we talked so he put march april may june his his 12 months plan to save money so he's got he matches my deposit and and he said he wrote how much every month he's going to put and every month he put more than what he wanted and at the time when we were when we started he was gambling as well he stopped gambling straight away and all the money went for deposit so you know he he did better than my ex in five years so if that doesn't prove something so that was i was well impressed and then and then with the yeah it's we imagine a lot of stuff you
The She had the list. She had the list of 27 points. 27 bullets. For real? 27, really.
Loïc Can I tell you the story? Don't. So, you know, I was gutted after I split up with my ex and my mom said, do you know what? Write down what you want from your future, man. Just write down everything, even if it's, you know, even if it's a small thing, even if it's irrelevant, just sit down and write everything what you want your future husband or or boyfriend to have said yeah okay so i sat down and she said it helps you to focus so i sat down and i wrote 27 bullet points i didn't dwell on it i just wrote it i folded i put it in my in my purse you know and then i forgot about it completely then we started together and then i just found the list and from the 27 bullet points Thomas had 24
The was it 24 or 25?
Loïc 24 you missed 3 that was the age obviously
The yeah sorry
Loïc it was the age it was dancing I wanted a good dancer
The and the accent
Loïc and something I don't remember what so that was another you know
The yeah so fast forward one year together get the house wait you got the house because when I came you were in the apartment I proposed a year and a half I proposed we were together for a year and a half and then we were preparing for the wedding so that was 2014 right correct and we bought the house in 2014 December 2014 and we got married in August 2015 yeah was it 15? really? yeah and then from 2015 from the honeymoon we were trying for baby the honeymoon which was in Southeast Asia right? it was in Malaysia and Indonesia
Loïc Sumatra
The and it turned out that the island we went to private resort on an island one of the most romantic places in the world was owned by one of our customers
Loïc as you do owning a little island
The yeah so then we we got pregnant it wasn't so quick we tried a few things acupuncture helped
Loïc straight away actually I went two months yeah two months yeah yeah um yeah and and straight away and the pregnancy all was good i was i was well i what the pregnancy was good as as uh i was healthy you know yeah well okay we skip him a little bit so we got pregnant and then i started to notice you know i'm naturally slim and i started to notice that i'm showing signs already in like week eight week eight like i had the belly like some women are you don't see belly until month four right and i've got belly in that's a bit weird right anyway so so week 12 she she wanted three kids
The i wanted one so for months and months and months everyone talking to us i used to say we're gonna have twins because i want one she wants three so we're gonna have two and it's done
Loïc yeah so we went we went for first checkup which is week 12 and as soon as as soon as i mean she just she just put the sun down and she's saying i remember me sitting there looking at the screen thomas here next to me looking at the screen and she said okay so it's two and i'm looking and said, okay, two legs, two hands, like, that's fine. Like, I didn't process that they don't have hands yet. And he said, no, it's two babies. I said, what? And he goes there, like, straight away. He goes, high five on me. Like, I wanted to elbow him. I was not pleased at all. At all. He was there. He was over the moon, wall calling people.
The but the straight straight that's when that's when the hill started to go down yeah you had like about a few seconds of excitement and then she instead of sending us home she sent us to i don't know another doctor into an office and they sat us down and they say right so you've got a very rare type of twins which is momo twins so it's not only identical twins in the same placenta it's in the same amiotic sac so it's extremely rare and the chance it's one to sixty thousand and the chances are one in four that you they're not gonna make it so wow yeah that was So when was that? Which week you said? 12? Week 12.
Loïc Wow. So from week 12, I was monitored regularly every two weeks. I had to have Sona. And every two weeks, basically, this was the news they were feeding us. Be prepared. It can happen. You can lose the static sticks. You can lose one or two. And the bigger they get the the more risky it gets they could get entangled with the umbilical cord you know
The because they're in the same sack with two coats normally they got separate sacks so they cannot really entangled but now they're in the same sack with two umbilical cord they're cuddling they go cold around the neck the cord can make a knot between them the cords so then both of them die so you have to go check them they're alive it's not like you go check that everything is fine it's like you go check their life so that was a bit difficult on the mental side of things but they told us not to risk anything 32 weeks so two months before eight weeks premature we
Loïc we delivered them no matter what the late the latest term is so i was i was due for cesarean
The for week 22 wow i don't remember i did not remember that so so you already knew they were gonna be premature right minimum eight weeks yeah minimum eight weeks okay yeah wow okay it was for
Loïc for me it was really i had to go through the hypnotherapy for for uh preparation for mental preparation because i'm very i was considering you know labor at home before i found this out So I'm very into natural, into... We had the dog and I castrated her so she doesn't need to deliver the baby, you know, because we had the Boston Terrier and they usually, they've got such a small pelvis that they have to go normally through cesarean to deliver the babies. I castrated her so my dog doesn't have a cesarean. And then I find out there is no, you cannot choose, you have to have a cesarean. So, yeah, that was a bit of a shock when I was going through the hypnotherapy.
The Yeah.
Loïc Yeah.
The And then one...
Loïc And the pregnancy was fine, you know, in spite of all this bad news and, you know, the regular check-ups. It was going really well. I felt well. She put on weight.
The The babies were growing well.
Loïc The babies were amazing. like i was and and you know they were not because they were saying oh it could happen that one is taking more nutrition than the other one will be undeveloped they were perfect you know both the same size yeah if if if i went to proper term like every week they were they were adding on exactly they would be four kilos both i was doing oh wow seriously yeah so like they were regularly every
The week putting on exact amount of weight if we went to 32 weeks they will be just under three kilos which is amazing yeah yeah so yeah and then one night she she she lost a little bit of fluid so okay let's monitor this nothing alarming um and i tell her like you know if it happens during the night you wake me up and we go to to emergency and i wake up during the night and she's not there i'm just thinking she's in the law or something and i'm waiting i'm waiting she doesn't come back up so i go down and she's there watching tv eating and i'm saying what you're doing i was hungry i was hungry i got up because i lost a little bit more fluid sorry what let's just go pack up we're going she didn't want to go and i wanted to go to work she wanted to go to work and basically we went there and she was dilating but kids were fine so we're waiting for hours monitoring the kids kids
Loïc are fine but she keeps dilating so basically my my uterus decided so in week 26 i was already as big as a woman in the nine months and um yeah and my uterus decided it's time and basically they put me on the iv and they were trying to stop the the opening but it didn't work so i was there chill as a cucumber the whole time i sent him home i was watching you know that there was like i i hear i'm on the department and i hear someone in the labor and you you know you know how the labor sounds right and i'm saying i'm nowhere close to this like i'm i'm always watching movies on mobile you know like i'm fine i'm fine nothing's happening it's all good then they send me on on sonography and the babies are fine babies were chilled as well i'm chilled well you know i was going through the hypnotherapy i'm chilled until i was not chilled when the doctor came and he's saying well do you know what um you keep dilating so you're going delivery you're going to cesarean now like now like now like you put the phone down and and we're going and um Thomas was at home because we were supposed to get another injection magnesium injection at three o'clock at three o'clock so I sent him listen I'm fine you go home you need to do you know our dog and you know prepare maybe stuff like like just go home and then come back for three o'clock
The I don't know what time that was that was like 10 in the morning so I go home I'm freaking out like it's a full-on stress i don't know what i'm doing i'm running around like a chicken and i'm trying to prepare the emergency bag because we didn't prepare the emergency we had nothing prepared obviously the bedroom was not even painted yet there was nothing ready so i'm there trying to find what she needs baby will need anything i don't know she needs anything i don't know i'm there trying to walk the dog i can't do that it's just like mental and then i don't get the phone call and i'm thinking she's not calling me she should have called me by now so i take everything i get out the door i close the door the phone ring it's her
Loïc and she says i'm going in come they gave me yeah so he's saying we're going now we have to my heart and i said i said can i please just call my husband he said okay quickly so literally i said just that they're taking me to the sound come now and i heard on the voice he was like
The you've got about five minutes to drive through the whole town go in a car park park the car, run through the hospital and get in there right now
Loïc get dressed, washed
The I don't know what happened I just know I crashed a car in a parking in a wall I remember that I ran, I arrived there they dressed me you know you undress and put the blouse whatever, I walked into the room
Loïc and there is 30 people there me naked on the table there's 30 people there's there's petra
The in the middle she's there in the state yeah in the state a bit and there's 30 people 10 for her 10 for each baby i walk in a minute later they does they do the injection period
Loïc so it was like good timing i was red with white dots you should see him like like he was yeah he was whole white no it was just white and red dots and the eyes and the hair I said are you okay and he said no
The yeah so then they do the they do the c-section
Loïc and imagine he still remembers in all that he remembered my hypnotherapy that was so lovely I didn't need it at all but he took my the the music the meditation the speak and then uh and then there was like a like a nose like some aromatherapy as well he brought it all i said do you want it no well attention to details no i love it wow then the yeah and then they started straight away they started
The and the
Loïc how quick was it from when you came
The it was so quick it was not 5 minutes she called me at 3 by the time I got there and everything they were born at 3.34 so it was pretty quick and for me the memory I've got which I wish I didn't is when they take Raph out so Raph was the first born Rafael he made the sound he didn't cry he was like a puppy if a kitten was dying like the oh awful awful and leo didn't make a sound so that was one of the first problem because we didn't know this but when babies are born they cry to close the duct of the heart which bypass the lungs so when they're in the womb the lungs don't work so they bypass by the heart and when they go out they cry if they don't they get slapped to cry so it closed the duct and the lungs start to work so that was one of first problem he didn't close second problem they didn't breathe so they are to reanimate them already and so there were so 26 weeks right 26 weeks yeah which is one kilo one kilo yeah raf was 1 kilo 85 grams and leo was 1 kilo 35 grams so there were six months oh yeah six months i didn't go to last trimester yeah so there were one just one call it one kilo which was amazing everyone was congratulating yeah they should have been 600 grams you know yeah one kilo was amazing it did help why they pull through as well yeah so then they go into incubator and only a few was it rafael who went straight away yeah only a few hours later not even that maybe one or two hours they told us like they cannot stay here we only level three you need to go to level four of of intensive care for babies because we don't have what we need here there are only few of them in England yeah so they went to another hospital which was now drive we're lucky because it could have been so much yeah it could have been four hours and they had one ambulance each and before
Loïc midnight they were already there no first one hold on first Rafael went straight away and then Leo went after a few hours and they actually remember when so so I haven't seen kids right you delivered so all this from me being chill as a cucumber to telling me you're going to deliver to take them away and never see right you never saw them i haven't seen them no i haven't seen them they took them straight away started to revive and then they they went into incubator so rafael went after pretty much directly and then leo he went after a few hours i was already at the department lying down and they said do you want to see him so well yeah but the amount of like like the stuff with the incubator it couldn't even come so i saw just incubator and the hand and that's it like like i
The didn't see and the the hand was it was imagine the nail the nail of your little finger that was the
Loïc size of the hand yeah like if he was holding you that was that was it don't you have a picture
The thomas where you have you have them both in like one hand one of your hand oh that was much later
Loïc yeah no they were they were old and big by then yeah the first picture is is you see just the
The hand the little hand the bright the bright red translucent hand holding my little finger and um yeah so they took them away i think i went home to sleep and then the next day you got out already yeah that's crazy that i remember so they were born on the 22nd and my mom and uh stepdad and sister as well yeah they were supposed to come to visit for christmas because we only on month six so you know it's no big deal so they still came and so after the birth the next day i had to go pick them up i picked them up brought them home and i think i went alone to
Loïc see the kids yeah i still didn't see i think i saw them on day two or three yeah and that was
The that was another shock like you go into that room the room is like a hole a big big square room 100 square meters maybe and there is 16 incubators 16 nurses minimum two doctors and assistant and radiologist and it's just like buzzing it's buzzing the light is everywhere the beeping is everywhere you've got machine for like each kid's got at least eight machines you got the breathing machine you've got the the machine giving the drips it's not even the drip it's like pushing it in and you've got the machine for the saturation of oxygen and it's just like and you go see your kid and it's that little thing naked because you can't dress them
Loïc they were too small for the tiniest
The and they're plugged in they've got like patches of like electrodes they've got like four electrodes they're intubated fully to their lungs so they've got the mask on uh they've got a thing on the finger on one side they've got ivy on the other they've got a bigger one on the other side they had the little hats it's just like overwhelming it's just yeah like there is no and it's just lying there doing
Loïc nothing not moving that was tough that was really tough and um it just feels it feels like it doesn't feel real no it feels i i don't know how it felt it felt it felt really unreal like like i don't like i didn't feel like these are my kids or you know like what am i living like what is this you can only touch them
The through the incubator and it's you cannot hold them no we didn't hold them for weeks yeah i remember christmas day was the first time i actually managed to speak to a doctor and bear in mind the growth the pregnancy was one in four to not not succeed and lose right now i speak to the doctor and now we've got one in two chances to at least lose one baby after they were prematurely born yeah and that was merry christmas so from that point the stress of the phone ringing is it the hospital is the nurse doing everything she's supposed to, is she gonna forget something are the breathing fine
Loïc I mean the care was incredible
The the care was incredible but you just stressed, you just stressed constantly and it was like
Loïc it was weird even between us you know like you you're so afraid of everything you like like we did not talk no for months we did not talk between it like you had so much stuff to process you know being there and you know it's not just the kid i was dealing with myself i mean the fact that i was released from hospital 24 hours after cesarean that's a that's a major stomach operation they asked me um you know did you go to the toilet number one number two yes i started to i'm a fit person i was exercising during the pregnancy oh can you walk yes i was you know tick tick tick i did everything do you want to go home well yeah but i you know i did not know they're not going to send me without the pain covering like they they prescribed me ibuprofen and aspirin ibuprofen four times a day aspirin three times after after the major operation like you know so so that was when you had to look after me and you had to shower me as well remember because because i couldn't know you know it was shock on the system like from from being okay to to all of the sudden they just open you up take kids away i don't see them for a few days then they close you down send you home I'm there in pain, no one can prescribe you any medication
The and you cannot cuddle your kids
Loïc and yeah, I'm surprised I didn't develop any depression or my relationship to them is fine because everything unnatural you can imagine happened
The yeah
Loïc like this is not you just say like I just wanted to have kids what is happening now we did not sign for this
The so then i i i started to go back to work because i only had the three weeks no i think it was two yeah two weeks i was working mornings so i had to get up at four 4 30 to go to work i came home it was 2 30 pick up petra go to see the kids we get there at 3 30 or 4 we stay there as long as we and i just remember going home driving and she's there pumping milk with the breast pump yeah the breast pump and i'm just crying driving home like and we're not talking and that was our daily
Loïc routine for months for yeah and you know you bear in mind it was like you go there and one day like it's not like they made the progress it was they make one step progress two steps back one step progress two steps and it's just like are they going to die no they don't and and it's just constant and every day i i i saw them uh i saw the light i saw the light go out
The three times it was it was two for one kid i don't know if it was leo raf and one for the next they were doing like the heart rate was at 200 which is normal for premature kids it's it's it's normal and the saturation of oxygen was always 98 or 100 because they've got the ventilation machine they they they got the sip up so it's pressurized high in oxygen air so they're always full but then one time i'm there and i can see the heart rate it goes down from 200 it goes down to 150 and it goes down to 120 and i'm thinking there's something wrong here there's something like the the nurse is here and you can see like there's something wrong and the the oxygenation goes down to 90 80 and it goes down and it goes down and the heart rate went to 20. and the the saturation of oxygen went to 20. and all of a sudden it's like you pushed on a side
Loïc and they reanimated the kit and that i don't wish it on anyone and you're just looking you just and it's just like happening like a movie in front of you it's it's you know like the the fact that you had nothing no input like you you cannot do it like this is my life now you have to deal with it and then and then i went home and i don't even know i had it easier because i i i was allowed to deal with everything on my own you know i was home and and basically i didn't meet anyone and it wasn't pleasant but it was nothing in comparison with with thomas because people are
The asking and they don't know you know they don't know so you don't you don't want to tell them like some people you do some people you don't but every time it's hard like you want to share but they're not prepared they they really do you know what sometimes and that that that that is bad but some people were so inconsiderate with what they were saying I I met them cry I told them exactly what was my day I told them the story I just told you and the person was a mom and she just cried on the table because they don't realize what you deal with oh you mean at the casino yeah yeah in the casino like you you yeah okay oh yeah they're premature babies okay they incubate them no no no no that's not what it is it's it's it's so much more like just changing a nappy i mean your dad you know changing a nappy can be difficult but when the baby is 1200 grams and he's plugged in on 14 different things and he's on the incubator and you're sideways it's like it's a challenge
Loïc to change a nappy you know like when you're trying to change a nappy with the you know you've got toothpicks yeah with tweezers so do you like tomas with his big fingers there
The i remember giving the first milk to the baby right do you know the amount of milk we give the first time ever yeah 0.1 milliliters yeah not one milliliter 0.1 was the first fight so they they're doing better with oxygen they they're doing better in general i think it's it's a few days or maybe a week or so or two weeks and we give we give the milk and they tolerate the milk so we increased the milk and we arrived to maybe two milliliters or something and they develop necrosis of the bowels so they're basically shooting blood so you have to stop everything because they're not tolerating the milk everything is necrosis
Loïc inside so we were dealing with the holes on the heart not the developed lungs so they had to be on a oxygen not oxygen intubated intubated and then they they've got the necrosis of the bowels
The as well it's and everyone is telling you but you know it's normal we see it every day like they're trying to in one hand they tell you you go one into chance then they die but when everything
Loïc goes wrong it's fine because we it's normal it's that's that's normal that is normality for
The premature yeah anyway shall we move forward yeah so you know move forward a few collapsed lung and breathing insufficiency and we we get to a lower level hospital which was in our town which was in
Loïc our town so then i had to be you know i didn't need to wait for thomas when he comes from work
The and long drive i just could be with babies and then they call us and they say right so we're getting ready for you to go home because they're gonna be 2.2 kilos which is big enough they will be going home on oxygen so we need you to come in be in a room with them for two nights and see if you can handle the oxygen because it's not incubator anymore and we hope so how old were
Loïc they at this point 84 days no hold on that was that was the term that was the term so that was be in March.
The Leo came home at 84 days.
Loïc You see, this is what prematurity is. With premature babies, you've got two dates. I'm still thinking of when the term is supposed to come. So for me it was zero, because that's when they were supposed to be born in March, where he's counting they already born in 84 days.
The How many days in hospital we spend? 84. we take a picture of the four of us which is hanging right there and we post on Facebook we're going home, we're so happy two minutes later the nurse walks in Rafael is not well, he needs to go urgently back into ICU his situation is getting worse and he's got collapsed lungs so he did another 30 days in the morning 3 weeks in hospital what what you went through i mean your situation even today is i mean this is so extreme um yeah that i think even back then when thomas was like you know um sending me some news or i've always been like you know um it's uh heavy emotionally but now actually yeah now that i'm a dad um and i mean it's nothing comparable right but when chloe was born there was one in one um what do you say that like one variable you know one of the stuff they check when babies are born like one of them was not right so i think it was on the first or second night i don't remember they took her away and she came back with a you know a big needle in like i mean not a big needle a needle but on a on a newborn it's it's a big one yeah it looks big um and i we don't really i mean they injected something and and just i mean and again that that's not comparable to what you guys saw um but just seeing you know your newborn with the needle um in the hand and she was like crying a lot a lot a lot like really crying not she was not able to uh drink any milk or anything so and that was you know that's that shakes you a bit so picturing you guys in that especially thomas what you shared in that room with like 16 premature and nurses everywhere or even just you know the 30 people in the room when you came in i mean yeah yeah and we we were one of the lucky ones yeah because one one they were one kilo which is great and two we didn't go for heart surgery yeah our neighbors went for heart surgery on week two do that and I mean they have
Loïc to we had the it was I think as the treatment with aspirin for for closing the duct yeah so you've got like three doses three doses of aspirin and it did work on both of them so we were lucky but other babies were not that lucky yeah you know you can have a you can have operation for bowel necrosis as well so we went through everything with no
The operation which is luck yeah I mean we are to keep following on the heart hole and Leos hole closed in when he was like four or five years old and rough closed about last year so we were cleared only from last year for the heart for both of them yeah so now they are just so people seven they're going to be seven in december yeah they're going to be so just to go back we we we arrived home we got one baby he's on oxygen and how do you
Loïc go to see your other kid in hospital regularly with the with the newborn and then he's on oxygen
The like he's got the computer telling you how much uh saturation he's got so he's plugged on that and it's plugged on oxygen so anything you do is without oh man that was a challenge to go every day see rafael in the hospital with leo it was it was tricky no but my mom came well your mom came
Loïc your her mom saved her life like she came she came when when leo leo came and it was actually do you know what i i think looking back at it um i don't want to say it was lucky that we came back with Leo only but it kind of we eased into it because coming coming with two babies it's just hectic like I never forget or it was so stressful so I was just gutted about everything you know like if there was a list like I wrote a list with Thomas like I want about my husband if I wrote a list how I don't want my maternity to go like everything ticked off everything you know there even scenarios what i didn't imagine it could go wrong so so when the finally we're going to have both babies and you know they're going to prepare us for for babies coming home and the the nurse from the hospital comes and you have to have oxygen so how many tanks did we have at home uh 12. so first you have to go through the course how to look after oxygen tank and how to you know
The health and safety as you do when you've got the kid yeah like in the kitchen no oxygen tank yeah
Loïc and then and then basically you had strategically placed the oxygen oxygen tanks around the house so so basically you had to unplug the oxygen and then run we run with the kit plug it again and plug again in the other room you know like when you're hoovering and you you finding the
The so that was that was us finding the oxygen because even even unplugged one minute it will go down to saturation of 80 it was it was just instant unplugged it goes down so they were on oxygen for nine that helps for stress so nine months nine months on oxygen it wasn't that bad though and that's because the lungs were not properly they were not they were they were not able to
Loïc breathe by for themselves yet so so they had to go home they had to go home with the oxygen um What I never forget also is the first walk.
The We had little bottles. We had tiny bottles instead of massive scuba diving bottles.
Loïc Okay, let's not exaggerate. Little bottles were still heavy. It's not like when you're making a whipped cream.
The So the scuba diving bottle, it's about 30 liters, isn't it? You tell me you worked in a diving club. yeah yeah i think yeah i had um yeah i had a 30 or yeah i think they are between 20 to 35 max 50 liters so we've got eight 30 liters at home stretching strategically placed around the house and you have to call them when you've only got like three left because you have to have in advance whatever and they come and do it for you it's great and then we go four eight liters one so
Loïc they're quite thin but they're still heavy. Was it five or ten kilos? Five kilos for one and
The basically... When you're going for a walk you know outside. So we had to make a harness to have two bottles on your back and then so you've got two bottles on your back you linked to it with the the oxygen tubes and then you've got the computers the monitors for oxygen on the pushchair as well and then obviously we had the dogs so just to add to the fun of it
Loïc it looked like Ghostbusters when we went for work
The yeah so I mean that part was tough but I think every parent when they get the kid at home they're not sleeping it's just that it was to another level like 30 hours of screaming it was not sleeping it was mental torture i tell you what looking back now i
Loïc understand basically they were not they were not acting like normal babies they were they had plenty of issues and they were not happy babies i did not see them smiling for first six months you know and and basically they were just catching up developing lungs just just just trying to develop internally we didn't even talk about motor skills and trying to turn around and stuff like that like no one even pay attention to that things you know um but they were they were just really really unhappy really i don't have any good memories they did not sleep it was you know they weren't four hourly so i was i was pumping i had the um breast milk um and a lot till they were in hospital. So I was, every three hours I was getting up and I was pumping religiously. So I freeze a lot and I had supply for six months. As soon as they were released from the hospital, the stress, I lost all the milk. But anyway, so they had like they were bottle fed my milk. But there was so many issues with them. Like they were four hourly, but the pure fact that they were not able to eat it at the quickly it took hour and a half to two hours to feed them and the burping because of the reflux reflux was so strong that burping took another hour and you had one hour maybe to fall asleep and then and then this is the opt we're talking about optimal scenario when both of them are sleeping at the same time obviously that didn't happen so you had first few days i don't exaggerate like i think i just changed underwear for first few weeks like i didn't take shower i didn't know i was just like when did i shower i just changed knickers man i don't know you know and and first week i didn't go even outside i remember when i took a little to the when i put her in the garden and i'm thinking like this actually feels strange because I haven't been outside of the house for seven days. And we did not sleep. You know, sometimes we had the night when I had like 20 minutes of sleep. They didn't need mother. They needed a nurse. I was lucky that my mom was there. And basically it was unbearable. It was unbearable. They were horrible. They were screaming. They were unhappy. And it was just so overwhelming. I didn't have one positive thing about the maternity for first nine months. Nine months were definitely not happy memories.
The So then we're getting to the point where we get a routine and they get off the oxygen. But hold on, maybe first, because how did you guys manage to go through that time? I mean, you mentioned your mother, Petra.
Loïc her mom was here for six months yeah she just dropped everything she had the job and you know and she just dropped everything she was supposed to stay for first two or three months and then and when she was supposed to go i just broke down i'm saying mom you you cannot i i am not capable to look after them it's and then she said yeah i can see that it's not it's not possible so So she stayed for six months.
The Mentally, you turn off everything. You're a zombie. You're a robot. You've got no brain. You just have to do something. You do it. And if you start to think or have emotions, you're done.
Loïc But you didn't have time for that.
The I was at work. It was overwhelming. Well, yeah, okay.
Loïc You know, like you just deal, okay, the baby cries. So you're just going through the, you know, you're not thinking you're not processing anything you're just going through through the motion baby cries your feet what's wrong with that now you know you're dealing with the everyday problems you don't have time to i didn't dream of of thinking how i feel or you know that you don't have time for that no you know it was it was nothing to be dealt with the first um we had And the amount of checking on us and the weekly visits and, you know, going back to hospital, checking up and stuff. It's just overwhelming. Everything was, it was just too much. But I remember starting because, as I told you, I used to be a nurse. I mean, you don't need to be a nurse to know that baby is supposed to develop, right? so so you're starting to know this and and you asking people you know like they've they've they quite delayed with motor skills you know and i mean we we had the our colleagues gave us a gift um and it was kind of like a seat where they were supposed to sit already and and and he was just like a marshmallow sitting like like they were six months old and leo was not able even at nine months old he was not able to hold his neck you know they were not able at nine months they were not able to roll over from from so you know how how severe that is like you had you had just like a newborn stage or just when you newly born and they were nine months old but then
The everyone is telling you don't worry they were premature they need to grow they need to catch up But for me, back of my head, I had read the hospital resume. And one of the first thing was brain hemorrhage, large, grade three, both kids.
Loïc Level three or level three?
The Level three. Large brain hemorrhage, grade three on both kids at birth. So for me, the back of my head, it was there. It was like, yeah, I don't want to think about it because I don't want to jinx it. I don't want to prepare myself somehow, because I know it wasn't good news.
Loïc So then basically we were waiting. Leo was home, I think, six months. No, four or five months when he got off oxygen. And then we were waiting for Rafael, which took another month, month and a half. So he got off oxygen in August 2017. and that's when I wanted to go me as a nurse, I knew there was a physiotherapy in Slovakia they were doing, it's called what's the name again? I forgot, Vojta? Vojta, yeah, it's a Vojta therapy and basically they're doing it on newborn babies, from newborn to one year old
The everyone you go for it for sure, it's like a thing
Loïc so so even even if you baby if you've got the baby on term but they delay depends on which doctor you're going but majority of the doctors will send you oh at this this week baby is supposed to be doing this and this your is delay so they send you there so i knew this is happening in slovakia and i wanted to go so um and i wanted to go from maternity home anyway so after after a
The a little discussion um she wanted so they're not allowed to take the plane because if they take the plane the odds are they might suffocate and die because they don't have enough oxygen in the plane because it's not because they were because yeah in the plane you've got a lot less oxygen and that's why you feel sleepy and they were not allowed so she wanted to go by train i was like no way like you're not going by train with those two babies on oxygen for what 60 hours with oxygen we didn't have no but like you know if something goes wrong you're not going there so long story short i drove there i drove there 25 hours drop them off sleep eight hours go back home alone 25 hours left them there for three weeks they did physio they told us yep something is wrong the delay there is something wrong I go pick them back up and we're trying to organize some sort of
Loïc physio I guess the agreement was she showed you what you're supposed to do and then listen if you don't find anything in England we're going to be doing a video calls and I tell you how you're supposed to be doing and you're going to be doing or physiotherapy through video call but luckily I mean that would be crazy luckily we found one Spanish guy who was coming to England every two weeks and basically we arranged like that, he came every two weeks and we he told us for these two weeks you're supposed to be doing this and it was it was another intense bloody horrible scenario four times a day, every four hours not four times a day
The four times a day, 20 minutes per kid you have to do exercises where the kid is gonna scream his head off because it's uncomfortable and it's to create a muscle reflex so he's trying to kick out a position you put him into and by doing it over and over and over the muscle reflex become muscle control right so we're doing this for a long time bear in mind that's when the hospitalization start to come in because they aspirated some milk because they got bronchitis, hospitalization 5 days so you go to hospital with one kid sick, he stays there you've got the other kid at home I can't work anymore, I've got the other kid at home and the other kid falls sick and you have to go hospital the kids get better, you go back home 3 weeks, 4 weeks start to cough like this, you can see it's like pulling on the throat here. The thorax is just pulling the wrong way. The kid is hyperventilating. Like, if something is wrong, you go back to hospital. And that's when we call her mom again. Like, please, please, please come and save us again. And that's when she came again. And she stayed another two or three months again. And the hospital, we're not going to go through all of them. but basically lungs for hospital from the moment they came home after the initial three months whatever we must have been to hospital for more than a day, right? like a proper hospitalization where you sleep there in a room right? 20 times?
Loïc yeah you mean ANE as well
The oh ANE for 6 hours? I don't count it
Loïc ANE is just like
The A&E is like you're going to the doctor because he's coughing. We were in A&E, you know, so many times. So that is a routine. Like the lungs, we just did two years without a lung problem. And he got a pneumopathy last week. And he went to hospital for three days. So that was pretty good. That was a two-year stretch.
Loïc Yeah.
The And only one of them.
Loïc Yeah.
The So we're pretty happy about that. So, yeah. So hospitalization, forget about that. I mean, that's my memory from when you were in the UK. Honestly, when I shared the story with, you know, like this weekend when you could not come, Thomas, or I explained, you know, in broad terms the situation. My memory from when you were in the UK is that you were seeing either a doctor or going to the hospitals at least like once a month, like minimum, that's what I remember, you know. or maybe it's exaggerated in my mind, but that's, you know. It's really, it's, I think a year per year, we must have been two or three times per child for a proper severe hospitalization.
Loïc It was always long, long problems.
The Always long. So we're going through that guy in London and when they're about 18 months old or maybe 18 months old, he kind of sits us down and he tells us you know I think you should go see a neurologist a neurolog and that's when yeah go on
Loïc because so we're doing you know all everyone everyone in the hospital tells you it's fine this is absolutely normal for premature babies you wait until they're 3 years old so we're driving to Slovakia and we're doing all this as a precaution because, you know, I want to catch up faster. I'm not going to wait for the nature, right? But everyone is telling you do not worry. I mean, I was not worried at all.
The Including in Slovakia that were telling you that?
Loïc No, in England. And then you're doing... So we had 9-10 months of the
The Vojta therapy
Loïc and they're not catching up.
The I mean, they do, but it's very slow. It's not what they're supposed to be doing.
Loïc They were still very severely behind on what they're supposed to be doing for babies, you know. And I think I started to have, like, questions. And then when he said, do you know what, I cannot answer these questions. You should really go and have a, you know...
The Neurologic opinion.
Loïc Yeah. So then our doctor, she set up, she said that we had like NHS, which is the organization in the UK, a health organization. And we had like physiotherapy from them. It was ridiculous, but it was, you know, you have to go through the process, through the motion. So we had one of the checkups when they're saying, well, actually, this time you've got here a neurologist as well. So they're going to look at your babies and say, fine. and and i remember it wasn't even you know i don't know what i had in mind but i really thought if it's like neurologist and and they're going to give you like proper examination maybe it's a kind of machine or something but the woman comes to woman just comes there she's observing them she she she kind of like oh stretch arms you know like like do the manual you know like when you're stretching the baby and you're looking at the movement and that was it and then she sits us down she looks at the file look at the file and um and she says uh i remember i remember how we're sitting and i don't know about you but i was not prepared at all as i said i was expecting some kind of really advanced examination before you tell me news like this and she says okay so you know uh you know your babies were premature and basically when they were born there was a severe hemorrhoid hemorrhage hemorrhage in the brain and basically what happened is um you know when where there was the the hemorrhage or the the tissue of the brain scarred and it means where is a scar it cannot function properly so as you can see like you can have a so your baby's got basically cerebral palsy it's called cerebral palsy um the good news is it doesn't get any worse what happened during the the labor it happened and it cannot get any progressive with a big smile on her face she was very pleasant she was very she was very pleasant she was sitting she had really this zen attitude and she was really she was pleasant she was smiling widely at us and she was it it really contradicts it to what what she's saying you know and um and you know from for cerebral palsy um it's actually you can have like seven different areas which can get affected and from seven you're very lucky i'm very happy to tell you that you you've got only one area and it's only lower lower you know it's it's only limbs like they could be not swallowing they could be the you know there could be brain damage there could be so many issues and your babies you're so lucky because they only cannot walk and and uh they will be on the wheelchair and they will be on the wheelchair and i'm saying okay so can you please tell me the best case scenario and the worst case scenario and she said okay the worst the worst case scenario is they will not they will never walk and they will be always on the wheelchair and the best case scenario is that they They will walk, but with the help, maybe the walker or the crane. But for the long distance, there will be a wheelchair. Listen, I'm there sitting, like I'm there in my zone like this. And I can just, I can, not that I see, I didn't dare to look at Tomas. But I just feel, I could feel him. Like the whole persona was shivering, right? and I'm saying so so you're telling me that the that basically the wheelchair is there all the time and she's saying with a big smile she's saying yes
The I heard nothing of that I heard cerebral palsy and wheelchair the whole rest gone
Loïc and then I'm saying so so so so so then you know i was there i was there shocked and she could see clearly on us she's there smiling and she could see that we shocked and she's saying she's saying i don't think you understand how lucky you are you know i work with with kids with cerebral palsy and and for me it's really a pleasure to tell you that you've got such a light handicap you could have been it could have been so much worse what could happen to you and i'm saying so hold on a second so me and my husband are very sporty people we go regularly to the gym we're doing competition we went through the you know tough mother and all that my husband's mother is a personal trainer his stepdad is a judo trainer his father runs marathon and you're telling me that my kids will be on the wheelchair and i'm supposed to consider that as a good news and she she was taken aback and she said okay i didn't think about it like that and uh yeah that was that was the news of how we found out who they're going to be disabled I told her, I remember this, I said, okay, I heard you, my reaction when she said this, okay, I heard you, I understand what you're saying, but no, it's not happening. I didn't have kids to be wheeling them around in wheelchairs. and that was it from from from that point i never it backfired a little bit few years later
The i mean it's it's a very it's a very tricky balance to have because on one hand if you accept it you kind of giving up in the other hand if you're fighting like we are when you get a slap back and they deliver the wheelchair for the first time it hits really really hard so it's a fine line we we we pretty much started straight away when we got the news with going to slovakia work has been fantastic with us we explained the situation and they were very understanding they were giving us
Loïc everything we wanted like we need a day off we went to slovakia can i um actually it was uh so we had the we had the breakdown for for a few days oh yeah we called we called the the the work work was amazing and then we said okay what are we going to do what we what are we going to there
The is no way i cannot just sit around like in england they tell us oh you wait and see but we know if you wait and see nothing happens we know that in in so many countries they're doing stuff
Loïc and they're improving yeah you know you know that would be in my head you know if if they're just lying around doing nothing you accept it like if if they brain that you can and if they're not moving and they're not reacting like normal people but they were like completely normal they were just delayed and and for me as a you know like you you you sporty person and it's a muscle you can train muscle you know so for me it was i i couldn't i couldn't comprehend what she was saying i'm saying it's it's it's a muscle you can work muscle you can improve muscle it's no way they're not going to you know we need to go more physio and i do not accept we just need to we just need to train so um i wanted um so then we found out about the fundraising somehow uh yeah i mean i don't know how that
The happened but i think you found you found first the the center yes yes yes i made the research we made the decision we talked to work and we're gonna go three weeks or two weeks no we did three weeks no we did three because we did one week we did one week of physiotherapy intensive every day one week of rest because it's very intensive one week of physio yeah we did three weeks uh we were trying to go four or five times a year you're going skipping again the fundraising it was amazing
Loïc um i i was going to ask for five thousand for first session thomas said no if he was already asking for money ask for it all so so we've got money for four session for first year so we asked 20 000 we asked for 20 000 and and people were just incredible yeah we we did we did collect we also had the colleagues were contributing the colleagues parents were contributing people were talking about it strangers were contributing it was it was it was amazing it
The was amazing i mean i remember going to bed i put it live i put it live i go to bed i wake up the next morning and there is two grand there already and he just keep ticking and he keep ticking and keep ticking and it went up pretty much to 19 grand yeah so that was that was a good a good feeling you know like like a bit of air you know like you you you've been drowning for two years pretty much and you you never catch a break and and every time there is a little bit of hope it's it's something hard happening so so we started to go so that was our life after we started to go no holiday but hold on sorry um so how old were they when um this neurolog or whatever told you that 18 months 18 months 18 months okay and so you started because i don't remember the crowdfunding when when it was i remember i was in paris but i i don't remember so it was a year and a half so they must be 2018 yeah 2018 okay oh yeah really late no it cannot be 17 because they were a year and a half so 2018 yeah okay and so that money was the purpose sorry Petra but just to catch up because I mean there are so many um uh things happening already so that money the first 20k were to fund one year of uh like special physio in Slovakia yeah where you would be going three to four times three weeks each time right and that's when people at work gave you days off as well people told you I'm taking two weeks from my vacation pool I'm giving them to you it wasn't vacation so basically because I had that in mind that people were like basically donating vacation days one time they gave us some holiday some people were giving us like a day holiday and a few people did that so that was great it was also great that the casino allowed it because yeah it's a big company like i mean it's a business but they were also very humane so but it's not just that it's just like it didn't matter what week of the year if i tell you oh you've got like uh you work in a big commerce commercial center and and during the christmas period or just before you have to go on holiday it doesn't matter you're not going right they just said whenever you need to go no matter what you go and that was it they really
Loïc like they kept the words the whole time they stuck to it and at the end it was unpaid holiday
The at the end it was unpaid holiday because you've only got so many holidays a year right so the the the 20k was also to
Loïc to
The to live from you know like you take free money to compensate the salary loss so we did that for I don't know how many sessions 20 sessions
Loïc I mean we did 4 or 5 sessions for 20k and the rest then you know we had very good money from casino so we just continue that's where the money goes basically
The you do 20 times 5k and you got the account yeah but the the logistic of it man you've got two disabled kids small rental car uh like oh my god it was we are so good at going on holiday now it's
Loïc it's easy for us you know when we're going for holiday now i mean it's still ridiculous amount We were going with the trailer, with the box. We fully packed. But it's literally three hours before we started to pack. Because it's just so quick now. Packing, unpacking, it's like doing a dishwasher.
The So after all these years we've been going to Slovakia, we've seen amazing progress, better than anyone has ever told us.
Loïc Yeah.
The we did have to get a wheelchair for Leo because he's at school and he cannot have us helping him walk around he is capable to walk with some splints with a walker to an extent he's not going to do a kilometer but when we go shopping on a Saturday afternoon it's like it's like you're going to a triathlon you know with all your equipment and stuff we go there with two walkers and we got two trolleys as well and it's like a train of people so raf is with his walker leo is with the walker petra is helping him and we just go around and it's an hour of physiotherapy while we do the shopping
Loïc it's a good way to combine the both so let's let's let's just summarize so so the lady was wrong so far. Raphael started to walk independently without the walker. He started refusing walk last year, where he would bring the walker to the maternelle, but then he would leave it in front of the class and he would just walk around. He's calling a lot. You can see he's disabled, the walk how it's you know hands up and but he's walking yeah and it's and there are always improvements and leo leo he um he can walk with the special walker so it's not lightweight he cannot he cannot go backwards he needs to be you know like it's forward only like the walker cannot move all the directions it's a bit heavier so he doesn't fall with it and he's walking with splints he doesn't do long distances but yeah so we know it's going to be
The it's going to be years
Loïc we will get there
The and the determination of that child
Loïc oh he makes you cry
The oh he makes you like a good cry and he just humbles you like how can I ever complain about anything when this child is going through so much and he's just telling you like daddy you know when i'm when i'm grown up i want to put the wheelchair away and walk like rafael and you're just there like when i was a kid i wanted a motorbike you know like you don't you don't yeah and they're doing they're doing judo as well like yeah now in now
Loïc our life changed very much since we came to France. I said basically it was England was very difficult. It was amazing. So we found after Slovakia, after we stopped with, after a certain point it was unbearable. It was not manageable to continue to go into Slovakia. So we were lucky because we found exactly the same way of physiotherapy about 45 minutes from. it was next to Luton airport Stansted airport and we started to go there weekly and we had very good physiotherapy and that was actually one of the reasons which kept us in England for longer than we should have stayed
The I mean we could say it was physio goal for kids just in case some English person is listening it's been amazing for us Oli and his team are amazing
Loïc Oli is amazing
The they really adapt to your child and what they did with both of them was was incredible yeah yeah they incredibly good so
Loïc um so we were grateful for that and then then but i knew that started to stagnate and we knew we were going to you know the covid came and we we started to be really unhappy it was extremely difficult the life was getting better in few you know it kind of one problem disappear and something else comes up you know like like okay they more mobile but they still very heavy you know um and it's still difficult and it and the fact that we it was just two of us with no family support and and no friends because social life was extremely difficult in casino industry no sunshine no sunshine you know it was drizzling you had a little window when you can go out and bear in mind it was always one of us and you had two kids falling and you know just it was messy it was unpleasant it was cold you know anytime they got a little bit cold they end up in a hospital and and it was just struggle so then after covid and when the situation in the casino changed we
The decided that we're going to move to france i mean it was a rainy afternoon in july
Loïc when we decided it was cold
The a snowy afternoon in the middle of summer I was like I was cold in July, there was the heating in the house, it was drizzling it was miserable and I just woke home and I just looked and I said you know what I've had enough, have you had enough shall we move to France, yes let's do it put the house for sale sell the house, pack up go, never look back yeah yeah and and in france it's been it's been tough because french yeah first year was tough the french administration is tough but we go very good with the breathing because basically we were missing the treatment in england which they don't give you but in france it's like they were shocked why they don't own this treatment because they don't have it there and the the coughing and the breathing has been so much better ever since from day one yeah the first because because of the dry air in no no no they were giving like it's a other yeah medication asthma treatment long term
Loïc and basically it's amazing in england they starting with that treatment when the kids are five years old or six i think yeah regardless of whether they needed or not and they had the first path and they improved so much so basically they were struggling there for for nothing then we got in
The In France, we also tried with the CBD because the kids did not sleep for five years.
Loïc Yeah. For me, being up 12 times a night was average.
The Average 12 times a night for five years, right? And we give them CBD and on the first night, it slept through. No, Léon.
Loïc Not Léon. Léon. Not Rache.
The So, two drops of CBD. Five years, you don't sleep. 12 times a night minimum.
Loïc two drops of cbd he slept through eight to eight and the child do you know how much he changed like you wouldn't like you don't really actually think about it but he was so much so much you know like when you've got the good sleep like he was miserable you know if he was he was bad he was not pleasant and then you realize well the child is not sleeping there for for five years of course is miserable you know and and and he was happy and smiling and it's like having a different child after you know they're growing up as well you know it's it's so now now we we still we managed to find
The a physio here which is not far from the house is only 20 minutes it's a neuro physio and she does do kids so that's amazing it's pretty much exactly the same we had in england so they're going two times a week they also go to judo on a Tuesday they also go to equi therapy which is with the horses they also go to occupational therapy on a Wednesday it's like continuous all the time swimming they go swimming as well I cannot work like if I had a 9 to 5 job it's not possible both of us we cannot no so one of us has to be the caretaker basically yeah and uh but it's getting better now we can see we we we enjoying life i think it's the first time in in long time we're enjoying life since we've got kids since we got kids for the last year that's
Loïc the first time we're enjoying life yeah no but it's it's it's hard it's it's you know but the
The reward though you know when when your daughter she walked for the first time that feeling was amazing right but how did it happen you just looked at her and she's getting oh my god she's gonna do the first step and oh she does the first step it's amazing wow we had to work for years and years so the feeling when it first happened oh my god that was but also you know that was
Loïc phenomenal yes yes and no because it didn't happen it didn't happen oh he was sitting down and then he got up and he walked i know it was a long process you know you kind of like i didn't i didn't feel that way i didn't feel like oh my god he's walking like i saw him doing one step and then you know and then two steps and it wasn't and and he still isn't I never got that wow feeling. You know, I find it's like people don't realize the life with handicap, how different it is, you know. In a sense, in a sense, I was wrong. I went through my journey when I basically didn't accept the handicap and I had to process it all. yes, I was right. It is a muscle and you can work on muscle. However, what I didn't know and I didn't realize at the time is it's not like healthy people, you know, like you make a progress and one day it's fine. And then you wake up next day and there is a regress for no reason. And you're asking why? So, well, basically I don't feel well. It is, it is pathological, you know, so you cannot you cannot have an expectation and that took that took me a few years you you you know i was pushing and pushing and we're going to do it and we're going to do it and i thought once they kept able to do it like rafael you know he starts to walk he's going to walk well he's still not walking and it's nearly seven years old it's not it's not the walk i imagine he will be doing it is handicap you know one day he's walking better and one day he's not because it's like if you've got the operation and your your leg is never the same after you know and and and you know there are there's plenty of ups and downs like sometimes i'm i don't want to be i don't want to feel like i'm not grateful because when you're going and when you start to go around these health centers and you see we've got sportsmen in comparison with how badly handicapped kids can be you know but sometimes i feel like if you if you if you've got the child which is severely disabled and and brain damaged from the first you you hit that bottom only once you hit it really hard and and you and then and then you move on yeah and you know what's your expectation where we never accepted it. And I was hitting the bottom so many times because I always thought, oh no, this is, you know, like with the wheelchair, like with the fact that, you know, I'm never going to experience that, you know, I come home and they're going to run towards me by themselves. You know, like so many little things. or last year when Leo got, every year there is something which knocks you proper, you know, some traumatic experience. Like when Leo was sick last year, basically he got, they were sick every two weeks from November last year. And sometimes around the March, he started to be really, not just sick as having cold and normal sickness, but he started to regress very dramatically on motor skills. And he started to be like proper disabled kid when you're looking at him and he is, you know, he cannot, he cannot, you cannot bend his foot because it's like, like a plank. And, and, and he's doing movements and, and, you know, it's like you, you didn't do any physiotherapy for five years.
The He was, he was, he lost total control of his body. His body was cramping up. So his legs were straight. His abs were contracted. So he couldn't move. He couldn't lie down. He couldn't lie on the belly. He could only lie on the side. He had no control over his hands. Everything was painful. He couldn't hold anything. He was moving constantly and he was crying and in pain. And that is just a consequence of the cerebral palsy. When you're sick and your immune system is down, the nervous system goes ballistic.
Loïc It was also demineralization. He was sick so much that he ran out of all the minerals in his body. He didn't have magnesium. He didn't have anything. And basically, and he was cramping. But when I tell you cramping, he was cramping not for, you know, when you go to cramp and it lasts a minute. It was hours. It was hours. And he was crying. And he was, and you could be doing whatever massage, you know, we were, we were calling specialists. were calling everyone we knew in France and no one could help us.
The The only help they said was volume.
Loïc Give him volume. This is normal for a celebrity policy. It's normal. It's basically, it needs to pass. And you've got the child, which is, you know, we ended up crying hysterically, both of us, because there is no worse pain than watching your child in pain. And no one helps you? And no one.
The you're calling specialists and they're just there oh he needs to pass and you can't help him and
Loïc just give him volume just sedate him like like what what the hell what the it was it was it was new trauma the last the last year it was new trauma and every time this is this is what the disability is you don't realize you don't realize and and even now he gets sick and again it goes on it wasn't as severe but it did happen but it did happen every time he's got the cold and he's feeling it it reflects on on the motor skills and he goes worse but then the good good part is when it's you know he catch up and it's not like he's they regressed he brings yeah he comes to the same
The but the for me what's what's for a year now i'm a lot less stressed right i'm i'm i'm trying to be you know always happy always seeing the positive and it's true you live better right but the the since last year february when this happened i'm always worried is he gonna get sick is he gonna happen again and now to see that he was sick and he came back a little bit i was i was so stressed and worried and then raf got sick and he went to hospital last week that was it that was all and there was the beeping of the machine at night during the night that was my worst nightmare like i was in hospital and that beeping of the machine came back from seven years ago it was it was awful so we're living a living a good life enjoying the moment yeah and praying the bad one don't come so soon
Loïc but the kids are amazing they you know you know i was worried how we keep pushing we keep pushing we keep pushing and especially leo was one which we always said he's very relaxed and he's he's rafael was very strong-minded from from from toddler when he decided i want to get up he's been doing nothing just getting up for hours he was holding the the side of the sofa and he got up and he fell and he got up and he fell and if he felt 100 times he didn't care he still got up until he mastered and rafael is like that he's very he's very like us he's very strong-minded very determined and when i when he sets his mind to something doesn't matter how long how much time and effort he's going to do it and he does it leo was much more relaxed Leo didn't you know and I said he's not like us and how are you going to inspire that child if he doesn't he didn't seem to care you dare to help me and it's fine and I know you're going to carry me here to there
The that was an issue like a worry and an issue how do you make him walk if he's not willing to do the work every day every day every day like you cannot motivate someone you cannot force him to do physio like he needs to be willing a little bit at least and well that he started when he started to go to school and and that's that's really tough because he realized he's he's handicapped and from what he's telling you it's breaking your heart and you realize he knows everything he notices everything and he's just so strong about it you know but he wants to now he wants to work and he's so proud when he does something he's so proud something new at the physio at home
Loïc you know for me it was it was another one of the moments when you it was the beginning of the summer and he said so the maternelle was finished and the holiday started and then he says for school, for the CP, I don't want to be I want to walk like Raphael, I don't want to have a wheelchair and I'm saying well Leo that requires really a lot of physio that requires really, you know and he said okay, so let's do it so basically during the summer he was walking and I'm walking and if you, it's breaking your heart like you know he's in pain and he tells you he's in pain like we went shopping and and we're shopping there for hour and he's walking and you can see he's in pain sweating and he doesn't want to take a break he doesn't oh no mama i want to be i want to be strong i want to walk you know six year old child it's it's if if someone is teaching you about determination it's him he went through so much pain like i haven't experienced in my whole life you know with with all the sicknesses all the all the cramps all the lung problems or hospitalizations and and he's so
The yeah he's so good about it he's so good about it he raf was in hospital and when they came out i was with leo in the car somehow and he says daddy do you know when i go hospital next time could I have this for a game? Because Raph had it, so I want it next time I go to hospital. I'd rather you don't go to hospital, you know.
Loïc They're amazing. They're very, you know, and he's always, Leo is always talking about when I'm 20 years old, I'm going to be running marathon. When I'm 30 years old, I want to be an architect and I'm going to build hotels and I'm going to build you a house. like six year old he's got he's got such a like he's got plans for his and and he he said i cannot walk now but i will walk he always i think it's from us like there's never basically the handicap
The is only now but uh it's not forever wow that was that was a long monologue loic uh Do you guys still have time or you have to go now? Just checking at the... We'll go a few minutes. A few minutes. Holy shit. How do I wrap that up? Yeah, sorry.
Loïc No, no. There is so much more we could tell you. Yeah, I know.
The I mean, I'm actually considering doing a second part because there are so many stuff I want to ask.
Loïc I think that would be beneficial about my breakdown when I had to go to Madeira.
The Yeah. yeah so I guess we're gonna wrap it up here as a first part that was I mean even knowing you and the story that was intense so thanks a lot for everything you shared well you know we always said sorry but not talking when someone is going through this is not helping them yeah what's been helping us is being able to talk to people who are willing to listen it doesn't mean they have to answer but just you're going through some deep stuff and when there is someone that you can talk to and it's not your wife which you share everything she knows everything but you just need to sharing with people is the most important thing so if anyone out there is going through something it might be cliche but just you have to talk about it with anyone
Loïc you're not always ready for it
The you're not ready for it so when you think you're ready you should talk to it I guess that's great advice I mean what I find difficult is it is such an extreme situation that do you think would you say from what you see when you talk about everything you went through with people do you have the feeling some of them somehow understand a bit of what you went through or or not really or you don't even accept i mean you don't even expect it you just want to share
Loïc to you know unload some some of that i'm sure there are there are parents who who experience not the same because every disability is different and you've got different health issues but there are there are definitely parents who can relate however we are not in touch with anyone so you know if we start to share it's it's people are shocked yeah yeah yeah it's it's it's hard to unload because you know i i was writing a blog i remember that period of time and basically i had
The to stop because people were not able to read it that was yeah you did what three three articles
Loïc four weeks yeah one i i posted every monday and basically they were not people stop reading they
The could not process it but also the the i mean we we did talk about this before like like when when we share something it's it's intense but we understand other people don't have the same issue it's not as intense but we still want to hear about it you know we still want to know your life is difficult too it might not be the same but to you it seems bloody difficult and that's that's quite important like i want to know i don't want to be the one always saying oh yeah i'm not happy so we're happy now no we're happy now but like you know you were saying about your your when your child had the little uh iv and there was like a needle coming out the hand well just that makes you realize that's it like every little thing touching your child is gonna be so traumatic to you that that's how people relate to be honest like one one one manager at the casino yeah we're gonna go one manager at the casino his son broke his leg and he was in the hospital for 40 days and i didn't have a child and i was oh yeah that must be tough but i didn't really think about it and then we got children and i was like oh my god 40 days little boy oh and and all of a sudden i've related with the situation so any any parent out there will will will get it well you mentioned something that's going to be the the the focus of the second part of this interview which is your life now as a happy family now with this conversation people will have the context at least yeah the baseline but I know you have to go now so thanks a lot Petra thanks a lot Thomas thank you Loïc well done for your English thanks for the practice and yeah let's catch up to organize the second part then you're okay no worries thank you Loic cheers guys thanks a lot bye thanks for listening to this conversation until the end the second part will be released in a week and available on all podcast platforms if you were inspired by this episode please share it around you also if you want to contact Thomas and Petra you can send me an email at hello at lesfrappés.com and I'll put you in touch thank you Keep itľaľkľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľľ Thank you. Thank you.
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